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Featured A Shamanic Obsession

Discussion in 'Religion' started by SimonSays, Feb 28, 2021.

  1. SimonSays

    SimonSays A work in progress

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    I resisted pursuing a diagnosis for ages. I did not want to accept any doctor’s ideas and conclusions, because I thought if I did they might start to become real for me in a way that would get in the way of who I was and what I was trying to do. At least that was how it felt at the time.

    My life has been a strange one. I found I could manipulate the system into living in a way that allowed me to have the time to explore myself and find out who I am. But for the most part, even though some of my realisations made a difference, being in the 'real' world wasn't something I did very often. I lived the weirdest, monastic-type life, that seemed to have been happy to be supported by the State (and all the bureaucracy it involved), a partner, her family, while doing what I needed to do, with people who loved me, but who were so different to me that it made no sense how we were able to.

    My partner taught me several lessons about being like this during our relationship. The first, in an almost military style manoeuvre, she left me during the night with our then 2 year-old daughter. I heard nothing and only discovered she’d gone when I woke up and found her note on the table. I can't tell you how devastating that was. It was like discovering the only people I loved in the world had died, and I went through a terrible grieving. Three long days went by, and just as I was about to go to London to stay with my friend, she called me and wanted to come back. What had died, suddenly came back to life, and for a while we were a proper family again.

    I was told by a psychic many years earlier that I’d always need a solid base. I’d always need that to go out into the world. I felt the earthing my relationship gave me. I benefitted from her doing-ness, her earthiness, which she seemed happy giving me, and that left me free to experience inspirational moments during insights gained through shamanic trips into higher consciousness states, and all the writing that came from them.

    In the altered state, things just made more sense to me, and I had very clear access to creativity. I could do, say, and write things. I would use medicinal plants to assist me in this.

    The plants were like the combination to a lock. They opened the door to this other world and let me walk through it. Once I did, I could stay there for some time, especially if there was a good reason to do so. But when the door closed again, as it always did, I knew I'd always need the plant to assist me.

    It’s different to the practice of those in the eastern traditions, who spend decades honing their ability to open their door naturally. I saw it as a kind of short cut. I can more easily open the door myself now, but the plant still helps. That’s its job. From the first time I took it, all on my own to experience it properly, I knew the value of it for me. You could say it was love at first sight.

    Why this is an obsession rather than an addiction, is in not needing to get high, not looking to get out of it, but experience a reality that feels far realer than the usual one I am in. It shifted me, sometimes a lot further than I was expecting, but I was always happy to come back. I just knew I wouldn't stay away too long. There seemed to be a never-ending opportunity to be creative in a way I just wasn't able to be without it. To see the Universe in a way that just made sense. To know God.
     
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  2. Finder

    Finder Active Member

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    I am not sure of the intent of your post.

    Psychotropic drugs do not make you you more creative. The "creativity" is simply the drug. I don't have any less of an illness if I take cold medicine.

    Also, if the drug is illegal and/or dangerous, how is that good for your relationship to your family? Placing yourself in a legal problem will not only hurt you, it could have consequences to your partner. The loss of your health can also change this relationship.

    You can lead you life, but recognize the implications of your actions and be prepared for the outcomes. I am certainly not judging, but it seems you have some important choices you are making and they don't simply involve yourself. If, as you claim, you are not an addict, then a decision to stop is simply one of priorities. But, if you are addicted, then you need to seek help. The chances a mind altering drug is not addictive is very low.

    I will not return to this thread. The answer for this is in a complex and difficult self-reflection on your part.

    Peace...
     
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  3. SimonSays

    SimonSays A work in progress

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    Lol...
     
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  4. _eri_bellehumeur

    _eri_bellehumeur Active Member

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    I've had very similar experiences with plant allies- I spent much of my life in a daze, not really feeling like I was of this world. There would be isolated moments in time when lucidity would hit me very hard, and the realization of what it meant to be alive was pretty crushing for me. My first experience using medicinal plants was definitely scary in some aspects, but it was the first time in my life where I felt very lucid, and I actually felt connected to the world around me as well as myself. It was more therapeutic and healing than anything I'd experienced up until that point, and was a key event which helped me out of a severe decade-long depression.

    I saw a documentary a while back about Shamanism in Siberia, and quite a few of the shamans had previously experienced mental health struggles. Shamanic practices are extremely intense, but all of the interviewees reported drastic differences in their quality of life and pointed to the plant allies combined with communal healing practices as the source of this change.

    I'm sure that people are going to be very upset about using particular plants as medicine (even though they've been used for centuries), and I honestly don't understand it. People are more than willing to accept all kinds of pharmaceutical drugs which come with long lists of messed up side effects like increased risk of suicide, physiological issues like major organs failing, symptoms that mimic Parkinsons Disease, and the list just goes on and on. But they then buy into the propaganda that plants which have been used for medicinal and spiritual benefits are "evil" or dangerous (which they can be, but again, so can legal substances and pharmaceutical drugs), when really the reason why they're illegal in the first place is because governments struggle to monetize and control them. If the concern was about health, substances like alcohol and cigarettes would be illegal as well. Medicinal plants are not going to be useful for everybody, and neither are pharmaceutical drugs. It's interesting that people focus on the dangers of plants and ignore how many people die of overdoses, have psychotic breaks, have increased negative symptoms or just see no results from prescription medication.

    Sorry, rant over.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2021
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  5. Aspychata

    Aspychata Serenity waves, beachy vibes

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    Just find peace within yourself, then you can truly navigate anything.
     
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  6. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    .
    I have learnt a lot very late in life.
    With plant medicine it’s not the taking of them it is what you do with the teachings. From what you have written it sounds like you have been in the “floor state“ without the plants that is to say you were already mentally prepared to take these plants.

    There are many people who go on plant medicine retreats without having done the mental preparation which starts in childhood.

    When you say manipulate the system I interpret that as being aware that you have a lot more influence and control over your circumstances than the majority of people realise. I heard of the law of attraction in my 30s but I was too old to fully understand the ramifications of this. I now understand this now that my life has manifested the way it has and I have looked back over and seen that I created what I now have.

    I am very sorry that your wife left you in the way she did. I am not very good at imagining other peoples thoughts and feelings but this is obviously are difficult events in your life yet you have the self . awareness if that is the right word to learn from it.

    As far as I am aware and from what I have read about monuments and blue faces in India for example the soma plant was used this being a psychedelic mushroom.

    You did not use toxic man-made drugs you use them in a way that if I had my time again I want that is a formal way for purposes of mind expansion rather than just getting high.

    Using drugs to get high and feeling spiritual is called spiritual bypassing. Using drugs to get high and feeling spiritual is called spiritual bypassing. You come across as previously mentioned mentally prepared before using these plants maybe you have been emotionally equipped to get inspiration throughout your life.
    You can open the door yourself at Will without the plants, to me this is more evidence that you were already mentally and emotionally mature enough.

    I have read plenty of accounts of people who use these plants in a formal setting without the years of mental preparation. Immediately after taking the plants feel psychically open and aware as if they have had a great epiphany however when reality kicks in it is very hard for them some have even gone psychotic. This is because they did not spend years doing the ground work even unconsciously. Like doing creative activities as a child and Forming good mental habits.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2021
  7. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    @SimonSays never mentioned that he did drugs he took medicinal plants for the purpose of mind expansion he did not take drugs to get high.

    I get the impression, if @SimonSays did not Mind me saying that he thinks the plants open the door to creativity when in my opinion even before he use them he must have had a high level of Mind me saying that he thinks the plants open the door to creativity when in my opinion even before he use them he must have had a high level of Ininner Stillness otherwise the plants may have appeared to work but when reality kicked back in he would not have learnt the lessons from the life that he did when his wife left him and the lessons learnt when in the relationship. That is my understanding.

    It is a shame you are not returning to this thread because I feel you have completely missed the point of what he was saying and if you do not return to the thread you are also missing out on the lesson that is nothing to do with drugs.
     
  8. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Maybe at first you are not mentally prepared for the plants so reality ***** you on the bottom but you do realise from what you have written their value. I fully agree with you that these have been used for centuries. The government don’t want us to have the wisdom that the ancients did. Medicinal plants alone are a tool.
    They have been associated with recreational drugs by the deep state. In reality our ancestors use them for tools they also use the art of storytelling and other non-ingestible tools.
    I don’t Think that you ranted on necessarily I think what you said about the government blocking consciousness and mind expansion is true Not far money necessarily but to keep the population dumbed down.
     
  9. Misery

    Misery Photo-Negative V.I.P Member

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    I hope this doesnt bother you too much, but there's no way I can resist asking this:

    Are you truly sure that you *need* to use those plant things in order to accomplish that? There's no way I could believe that it's only possible to accomplish through that. There's always so many different methods of... of... bah, I'm not good with all these terms. Methods of "interacting with the metaphysical", maybe? Does that sound right? I dont know. But there seems to be, from what I hear, so very many options in terms of approaches.

    Granted, I in no way claim to be an expert. But, you know that, we already had that chat... whatever the heck is happening with me is all on auto, so I dont have a very good perspective.

    But still, when I think about it logically... it just seems like plants/chemicals just arent a very good option (because of health reasons), and certainly not the only option either. Wouldnt it be better to increase your own ability so as to not even need them?

    Bah, I'm not very good at this, am I. Anyway, that's just what crosses my mind when I read your post there.
     
  10. Fino

    Fino Alex V.I.P Member

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    I had similar experiences with LSD and Ecstasy but I have no use for that sort of thing now that I'm Christian.
     
  11. Bibliophile715

    Bibliophile715 Armin - system member - any pronouns

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    As someone who is partly agnostic, I don't mind what others do if it helps them explore themselves. The 'potential' paranormal experiences I had did switch me from being an atheist to being partly agnostic, so it's not something to be taken lightly if you do believe you are in the beginning or in the process of a spiritual transformation. If you want to use substances like that, feel free to. If it helps you achieve a greater clarity of mind, that's great. Go for it.

    I never need to use any sort of substance for myself for anything like that as I am one of the people in the minority who have been meditating for years due to having anxiety. So if I want to get in an extremely meditative state all I have to do is to calm myself for a few minutes. From that I already have doors unlocked in my mind and I can travel through my mind space at will as I am extremely familiar with it. Good luck getting to be familiar with yours.
     
  12. Tom

    Tom Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Medicinal/Conciousness qualities aside, I think plants also deserve some respect as living creatures. They don't have brians or conciousness themselves apparently but still are alive and have as much right to live as anything else I suppose. Also, there are surprising things about plants being discovered such as forms of simple communication between trees thru chemicals released underground. And in some respects they outdue us. Who can match the beauty of a flower or majesty of a tall tree.
     
  13. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Some would argue that Plant are conscious.
    In ancient times the medicinal plants telepathically communicated to the ancient people their properties and this is how people found In ancient times the medicinal plants telepathically communicated to the ancient people their properties and this is how people found Out what each plant did, rather than poisoning themselves.
     
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  14. Alexej

    Alexej Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I write form the point of view of one who has not used plants to help me access the spiritual world.

    Access the spiritual through non plant based approaches is possible, and takes time.
    If you access the spiritual through plants, what happens when there is no source of plants? Do you become dependant on the plants for this access?
     
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  15. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    @SimonSays posts show that he does not use the plants as drugs and can access the spirititual without them.
    May I ask did you read a lot of fiction novels as a child and teen.
    This is said to help create a mind state where one can access the spiritual world.
     
  16. Alexej

    Alexej Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I stand corrected - thank you for that, and apologies to simonsays

    No I have never been a it fan of fiction, and have not read much of that ilk
     
  17. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Interesting, how did you learn to access the spititual
     
  18. Alexej

    Alexej Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I have accessed the spiritual through prayer, contemplation and meditation.

    I do not often experience things in the spiritual realm, but this has been my doorway. I continue in these practices. I know the longing for union, which is found in the Song of Solomon but also in this poem by Rumi.

    One night a man was crying,
    “Allah, Allah!”
    His lips grew sweet with the praising,
    until a cynic said,
    “So! I have heard you
    calling out, but have you ever
    gotten any response?”
    The man had no answer for that.
    He quit praying and fell into a confused sleep.
    He dreamed he saw Khidr, the guide of souls,
    in a thick, green foliage,
    “Why did you stop praising?”
    “Because I’ve never heard anything back.”
    “This longing you express
    is the return message.”
    The grief you cry out from
    draws you toward union.
    Your pure sadness that wants help
    is the secret cup.
    Listen to the moan of a dog for its master.
    That whining is the connection.
    There are love dogs no one knows the names of.
    Give your life to be one of them.
     
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  19. Major Tom

    Major Tom Searching for ground control... V.I.P Member

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    I don't know about "God" so much, but often music, splitting wood, and my hobby of throwing all sorts of metallic objects into wood helps me achieve a somewhat meditative state. If anything a very focused and relaxed state. Photography can also do it as well.

    Plants are often overlooked in western civilization, but where I live, they are highly utilized by people. I actually take an herbal remedy for sleep containing Angelica acutiloba, Atractylodes lancea, Bupleurum falcatum, Poria cocos, Glycyrrhiza uralensis, Cnidium officinale and Uncaria rhynchophylla. This mixture helps me to sleep better, have fewer nightmares, helps with irritability, anxiety and gives me a general sense of calmness. It's one of the first treatments they give to children with autism where I am. It also helps my son as well. The drawback is that it tastes pretty nasty. Here's a link to it: https://www.researchgate.net/public...,Cnidium officinale and Uncaria rhynchophylla.
     
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  20. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Thanks for the poem.