A Question Of Comparisons

[FayetheAspie]

I was wondering what the difference is between schizotypal pd vs asd with the magical thinking subtype of ocd as a comorbid condition. It is not because of relating to it. I am just curious due to how similar the descriptions sound. I do have asd confirmed but the types of ocd that I relate to and may have though unconfirmed are the contamination subtype and the checking subtype. I guess since realizing that I had asd and adhd, mental health has become somewhat of an interest.

 

[Judge]

Good question. But then there are a number of comorbid conditions to autism that seem to confuse me in terms of not only identifying them individually, but also being able to discern when one ends and the other begins.

Theoretically I may well fit the description of Schizotypal personality disorder at least in part. But then I can also say something similar regarding other comorbidities.

Or maybe the DSM-V is just trying to make us crazy. Or perhaps they have nothing better to do than "split hairs" medically speaking. I'm not sure.

 

[Judge]

It's a dichotomy to me, about the DSM-V outlining Autism Spectrum Disorder.

On one hand they have reinterpreted autism being on a spectrum of traits and behaviors, which seems closer to our reality. Making us a bundle of individuals who cannot be judged or described on any kind of "cookie-cutter" basis. Which to me makes great sense.

Yet in the process of doing so, have also complicated diagnostic processes sometimes to a point where it becomes debatable whether one is autistic or not. Or where comorbidities begin and/or end. Or are they actually just extensions of autism itself? And at the same time acknowledging that some can have the same comorbidities, yet not necessarily be diagnosed as autistic.

At sometimes leading me to think that it's a scientific way of lamenting,"We just aren't sure what it is" at times.

 

[FayetheAspie]

And it seems like most neurotypicals and even some autistics have a set view of which presentation is the real way that autism presents and treat you accordingly. Sometimes they think you are incapable of things that you actually excel at and other times expect you to be better at something than you really are. Yet others apply traits that are not even part of the diagnostic criteria. At the job where I used to work, there was a guy who would try to warn others to stay way from another employee if they were autistic because he claimed that being autistic meant that they had multiple identities . In fact, it seems like a lot of people where I live think that autistic means dangerous. If they hear of your diagnosis they will get all nervous and watch you with a fearful expression or else take on a defensive posture and study you like they are sizing you up even though you have done nothing . Most of the rest speak to you in baby talk.

 

[jsilver256]

You can search Youtube videos to explain differences between two conditions. It seems to me that schizotypal personality disorder is characterized by a lack of enjoyment in everything, as in you just play video games all day, while in ASD the desire is still there. I do wonder if being active on a forum such as this one is a counter-indicator of schizotypal personality disorder.

 

[FayetheAspie]

@jsilver256 What you described sounds more like schizoid pd than schizotypal pd.

 

[Judge]

You can search Youtube videos to explain differences between two conditions. It seems to me that schizotypal personality disorder is characterized by a lack of enjoyment in everything, as in you just play video games all day, while in ASD the desire is still there. I do wonder if being active on a forum such as this one is a counter-indicator of schizotypal personality disorder.

Good point. With so many "plusses and minuses" in the equation, it may well serve to deprecate such alleged disorders to a point where they may seem questionable- even meaningless.

Frankly I think "umbrella" types of disorders (like schizotypal personality disorder) with so many traits and behaviors may be unrealistic in diagnosing because they simply cover two much ground, and in the process may even "overlap" other conditions that may be more unique and exclusive.

I have a number of such traits, yet not all of them. In some ways I am quite withdrawn from my own species, and in other ways continue to interact with my fellow autistics and have done so for the last 11 years here. In terms of a "lack of enjoyment" I can relate that to my comorbid clinical depression, yet I have certain hobbies I enjoy very much. Perhaps above all, like my depression my traits and behaviors "undulate" in intensity...ebbing and flowing. Making such sweeping descriptions of such disorders seem unrealistic and inadequate.

"Schizotypal personality disorder, also known as schizotypal disorder, is a cluster A personality disorder. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders classification describes the disorder specifically as a personality disorder characterized by thought disorder, paranoia, a characteristic form of social anxiety, derealization, transient psychosis, and unconventional beliefs."

 

[FayetheAspie]

I don't relate very much to these presentations. Personally, I was a more extroverted autistic child but learned at an early age to fake introversion to escape my dad's wrath. It panics him for me or my Mama to speak to people and he can get very angry at times. Sometimes I wonder if suppressing my naturally bubbly (though quirky) and once extremely talkative personality is why I get bursts of euphoric hypomania or something similar. I wonder if it is an exaggerated version of my real personality bursting out of its extremely introverted mask.

 

[Judge]

I don't relate very much to these presentations. Personally, I was a more extroverted autistic child but learned at an early age to fake introversion to escape my dad's wrath. It panics him for me or my Mama to speak to people and he can get very angry at times. Sometimes I wonder if suppressing my naturally bubbly (though quirky) and once extremely talkative personality is why I get bursts of euphoric hypomania. I wonder if it is an exaggerated version of my real personality bursting out of its extremely introverted mask.

Was bipolar disorder ever considered in your case or ruled out? Just wondering.

However if you are truly able to deliberately suppress manic behavior I have to assume that such voluntary control would not be indicative of being bipolar. I just find it interesting to ponder those times when we may have such control and most other times when we don't.

Being raised in a military household was one where I had to be careful about expressing myself on general principle. Often a matter of speaking only when spoken to by our "commanding officer". I sometimes wonder if living in such an environment as a child helped to disguise my autistic traits and behaviors until I got older- and progressively more defiant.

LOL...being a natural extrovert in my family would not have been advised. Something my older brother had to often grapple with. Small wonder I was introverted...

 

[FayetheAspie]

@Judge I was not referring to suppressing manic behavior but rather saying that maybe hypomania (less than mania but similar) was perhaps caused by trying to suppress my natural extroversion and my hyperactive adhd causing the hyperactivity to build up and be a little over the top by the time it demands to come out a bit (generally looks like galloping back and forth while yodeling or singing nonsense rhyming sentences in opera and frequent laughter for 15 minutes to an hour accompanied by an enthusiastic euphoric mood about 1 to 3 times per day on days that I am generally upbeat and happy and tend to overestimate what kind of career I think I could do with minimal training). They never said they were checking for bipolar, but I think they did because they had me do a mood chart. I have never had full blown mania and therefore can not have bipolar 1 and I don't have episodes of major depression which eliminates bipolar 2. I have considered cyclothymia which is mild hypomania alternated with mild depression and I think is basically considered to be bipolar's milder cousin so to speak (if maybe I am mistaking mild depression as simply boredom on the days that I just think I was a bit bored and slightly discouraged most of the day?).

 

[FayetheAspie]

If anyone on here has a diagnosis of cyclothymia or knows someone who does , does what I am describing in the post directly before this one sound like this condition?

 

[FayetheAspie]

Being raised in a military household was one where I had to be careful about expressing myself on general principle. Often a matter of speaking only when spoken to by our "commanding officer". I sometimes wonder if living in such an environment as a child helped to disguise my autistic traits and behaviors until I got older- and progressively more defiant.

LOL...being a natural extrovert in my family would not have been advised. Something my older brother had to often grapple with. Small wonder I was introverted...

@Judge I would not be surprised if it did cause you to hide some of your autistic traits.

 

[Judge]

@Judge I would not be surprised if it did cause you to hide some of your autistic traits.

No doubt. I was masking for years before I even began to understand what it actually was.

 

[FayetheAspie]

@Judge I was not referring to suppressing manic behavior but rather saying that maybe hypomania (less than mania but similar) was perhaps caused by trying to suppress my natural extroversion and my hyperactive adhd causing the hyperactivity to build up and be a little over the top by the time it demands to come out a bit (generally looks like galloping back and forth while yodeling or singing nonsense rhyming sentences in opera and frequent laughter for 15 minutes to an hour accompanied by an enthusiastic euphoric mood about 1 to 3 times per day on days that I am generally upbeat and happy and tend to overestimate what kind of career I think I could do with minimal training). They never said they were checking for bipolar, but I think they did because they had me do a mood chart. I have never had full blown mania and therefore can not have bipolar 1 and I don't have episodes of major depression which eliminates bipolar 2. I have considered cyclothymia which is mild hypomania alternated with mild depression and I think is basically considered to be bipolar's milder cousin so to speak (if maybe I am mistaking mild depression as simply boredom on the days that I just think I was a bit bored and slightly discouraged most of the day?).

@Judge In addition to the sample I gave above, sometimes it is just a lot of pacing, rapid speech, random questions, and frequent giggling, and doing things like spinning in circles on my heels while speaking to people all with a slightly elevated mood. This example is harder to give a time frame on because it can be my general demeanor to varying extents for a couple days or maybe even a week or so, but not necessarily consistent throughout the entire day. I do have about 2-4 day time afterwards where I feel a tad sluggish and bored but don't know if it really classifies as depression or not. It is very mild depression if it is depression. Do you think my adhd could account for this ?

 

[Judge]

@Judge In addition to the sample I gave above, sometimes it is just a lot of pacing, rapid speech, random questions, and frequent giggling, and doing things like spinning in circles on my heels while speaking to people all with a slightly elevated mood. This example is harder to give a time frame on because it can be my general demeanor to varying extents for a couple days or maybe even a week or so, but not necessarily consistent throughout the entire day. I do have about 2-4 day time afterwards where I feel a tad sluggish and bored but don't know if it really classifies as depression or not. It is very mild depression if it is depression. Do you think my adhd could account for this ?

Pacing in circles is one of my two stims. A family friend nicknamed me "Judge" as I also used to pace with my hands in my pockets with a very serious look on my face. I also have a tendency to sway from side to side when I stand stationary for any time, particularly when in front of a tv set.

Given so many different and some milder symptoms/mood swings, it could be ADHD. Perhaps as well if impulsive behaviors happen with no real sense of consistency. But I can only speculate.

"ADHD symptoms can include impulsiveness, disorganization, poor time management skills, trouble focusing on tasks, excessive activity or restlessness, poor planning, low frustration tolerance, frequent mood swings, trouble completing tasks, and difficulty coping with stress. Symptoms can vary from mild to severe and may persist into adulthood."